Daring to keep it simple can also produce great results…
Klik hier voor de Nederlandse versie
We started this recipe as a one-off experiment, thinking the result would not be that interesting, compared to the other bread recipes we already know and love. But the end result really surprised us. As you might expect, knowing some of our other favorite recipes, the key factors for this one are the same: time, timing and really good flour!
This recipe is the first to have a ‘dough calculator’ (see ingredients list). Other recipes will follow soon!
Although there does not seem to be strict definitions about French bread terminology, we simply call this bread ‘Pain Naturel’ or abbreviated PN. We chose this name because it stands for a basic yet full flavored sourdough bread, made just from ‘white’ bread flour. Using our own sourdough culture we found the bread gets a pleasant hint of sourness, which combines very well with the sweet flavor of the flour we use.
And especially because this bread is made with ‘white flour’ only, it is important to get the best quality, organic, stone ground flour you can get your hands on. When you do, we truly believe you will be rewarded with amazing taste and depth of flavor, better crumb structure and the crustiest of crusts.
Enjoy the recipe and let us know what you think. Also check out our handy sourdough tips to get the most out of your sourdough baking!
Before you start
For this recipe we are going to make a starter named a poolish. A poolish is a type of wet sponge usually made with an equal weight of water and flour and a small amount of sourdough starter culture or yeast and NO salt. Making a poolish helps bring more taste and strength to your bread.
We use a sourdough culture which is made with 100% whole grain rye flour. A sourdough culture based on rye flour is easier to maintain, does not go into a slurry when you forget about it, is easier to stir because it has almost no gluten and smells very nice, a bit like fruit. It is also very forgiving in the amount you feed it, everything seems to be alright. Normally we only feed it once a week, after our weekend baking we give it a few table spoons of water and rye flour, stir, ready!
| Ingredients for the Poolish | ||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
| 115 | g | wheat (bread) flour | ||
| 115 | g | water (room temperature) | ||
| 15 | g | sourdough culture | ||
| Ingredients for the Pain Naturel | ||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
| makes 1 loaf | ||||
| the poolish from step 1 | ||||
| 340 | g | wheat (bread) flour | ||
| 180 | g | water | ||
| 7.5 | g | (sea) salt | ||
Making the Poolish
In a bowl stir together the 115 g flour, 115 g water at room temperature with the 15 g sourdough culture. Mix it well until you have a homogeneous slurry that looks like very thick batter. Cover the bowl with clingfilm and let the prefermenting begin. After 12 hours at room temperature it should be bubbly, light and ready for use. So if you want to begin your bread making in the morning, you should make your poolish at 9 in the evening.
Note: We use European flour which absorbs a few % less water than American type flour. People using American type of flour should add 5-15 ml water to the final dough.
Making the Pain Naturel
Put the poolish starter and flour in the mixing bowl of your standing mixer and add 2/3 of the water (do NOT add the salt yet). Now start mixing and gradually add the rest of the water and let the dough come together. Knead for only 1 minute, leave it in your mixing bowl, cover with clingfilm and rest for 20 minutes (this technique is also referred to as autolyse).
Now add the salt and knead for another 4 minutes. Transfer the dough to a greased bowl, cover and leave to rest for 50 minutes.
Ideally the temperature of your dough after mixing should be around 24-25 ºC / 75 ºF. You should adjust the temperature of the water you add, so the total dough reaches this temperature. For us this means in summer adding cold water to this recipe and in winter (when our little bakery gets much colder then the rest of our house) adding water up to 50 ºC /122 ºF. You can measure the temperature of water and dough with a food thermometer. These measurements are important because they correspond with the proving times in the recipe.
After the first 50 minutes rest take the dough out of the bowl and onto a floured work surface and do one stretch and fold (a full letter fold, left over right, right over left, bottom over top, top over bottom; watch our bread movie or our stretch and fold method video to observe this technique if you are not familiar with it). Transfer to the bowl, cover and again leave to rest for 50 minutes. Repeat the stretch and fold (full letter fold) one more time (so 2 times in total) and leave to rest for 50 minutes (so this is the third and last of your three 50 minutes resting periods). During each stretch and fold the dough should feel firmer and less wet.
Now it’s time to shape. Shaping is a tricky subject. It’s something for which everybody develops his or her own favorite technique over time. You can make a batard or loaf shape or a boule (ball) shape like you see in the pictures. If necessary you can learn more on shaping from a good bread book, like the ones by Hamelman or Reinhart, or the Tartine Bread book. Or take a look at our boule shaping video.
Preheat your oven to 230 ºC / 445 ºF conventional setting (at what stage you preheat your oven depends on how long it takes for your oven to heat through, some take 30 minutes, some, like ours, with stone floors take a lot longer, up to two hours).
Transfer the shaped dough to a proofing basket / banneton, cover and leave to proof for 2 hours and 30 minutes (provided your dough has a temperature of around 24-25 ºC / 75 ºF, also check our tips on dough temperature). When you think it has risen enough, use your finger to carefully make a very small dent in the dough. If the dent remains, the bread is ready to bake, if the indentation totally disappears, the dough needs a little bit more time.
Now your loaf is ready for the oven. Slash the top of the loaf with a lame or bread scoring tool. To get a nice crust, try to create some steam in your oven by putting a small metal baking tray on your oven floor when you preheat the oven, and pour in half a cup of hot water immediately after putting the bread in the oven. Release some steam by setting your oven door ajar (perhaps with the help of a wooden spoon or oven mitt) 5 minutes before the bread is ready. If you are going to create steam with a baking tray, you may also want to turn your oven temperature a bit higher, because you are going to lose some heat in the process.
After 45 minutes of baking your loaf should be ready. Transfer onto a rack and leave to cool. This loaf also keeps very well in the freezer. But please make sure to eat at least some of it while fresh. This bread is great with just about anything, but also very tasty on its own.
Pain Naturel Time Table
Day 1 21.00 Make starter let ferment for 12 hours at room temperature
Day 2 0.900 Make final dough
- 09:00 – Add flour and water to starter, mix for 1 minute
- 20 minutes rest (autolyse)
- 09:20 – Add salt
- Knead for 4 minutes
- Rest for 50 minutes
- 10:14 – First stretch and fold
- Rest for 50 minutes
- 11:04 – Second stretch and fold
- Rest for 50 minutes
- 11:54 – Shape
- 12:00 Final proofing 150 minutes (2.5 hours)
- 14.30 – Bake for 45 minutes at 230ºC / 445ºF
- 15:15 – Your loaf is ready!
Susan says
Hi Marieke and Ed,
1 Would you be so kind to advise me as to whether it is better to use a baking stone, a Pyrex dish with lid, or a Dutch oven [heavy cast iron pot with lid] to bake my sourdough [SD] bread?
2 Can I leave my dough to rest for more than 50 mins and 2.5 hours?
3 My rye starter seems to be rather dry. Is it supposed to be dryish?
Thank you,
Susan
Weekend Bakers says
Hi Susan,
1. First of all it is a question of personal preference, but if we had to choose we would start with the Dutch oven, because it creates an oven in an oven and gives excellent results for many people, especially if your own oven is not fully sealed. A stone, well heated, also gives great results and can give your bread a good lift with bottom heat. We do not have any experience with the pyrex dish, but if you own one, we would suggest you just try it out.
2. You do have some room depending on the temperature of the dough and your room, however we would advice to stay below more than 50% deviation of the given times.
3. This is something you are allowed to change. It depends on the absorption of the flour you use. Our preferred substance looks like Greek yogurt. You can play around with it a bit. also see our tips on the subject: www.weekendbakery.com/posts…ough-tips/
Hope this helps. Happy baking!
Ed & Marieke
Susan says
Hi Ed and Marieke,
First, thank you for both your replies. I am a happy bunny today, as I have today again made this bread and your walnut bread, and they both turned out very well especially the latter. Can I add more walnuts or more dried fruit than the amount suggested in your recipe of a total of 120g. Can I increase to a total of 150g of nut and fruit?
BTW, I baked my bread in a small Pyrex dish today and it worked brilliantly. I have found that if one uses a small tight-fit dishor pot, the bread rises taller, as it is PUSHED up rather than spreading sideways. I have noticed this a few times. So the secret is not to use a great big pot/Dutch oven, but a small pot just big enough just to drop the dough in.
Your SD starter of 100% rye is the best. I have tried others, which all turn weak, soupy and do not smell as sweet as your recipe. I have two jars in the fridge now fermenting away.
My SF sourdough bread did not turn out as well, so I will try again. Don’t know what went wrong. The taste and flavor were great, but it did not rise very much, Only an inch tall. It was very holey which is how I like it.
Do you know why it has not risen?
Sorry for asking so many questions, but I am a novice and need help.
Thank you for taking time to reply to my emails.
Susan
Weekend Bakers says
It will be no problem going to 150g. Thank you for sharing your pyrex result. That sounds like a very good option.
It is very hard for us to judge what went wrong with a bread without seeing it or knowing exactly what someone has been doing. It can either be over- or under-proofed or could be something to do with your culture.
Just keep practicing and making notes and as your culture matures it will get stronger and better too.
Happy baking!
Susan says
Hi Marieke and Ed,
Two miracles happened today: Great Britain won the Davies Cup and a perfect sour dough bread, your Pain Naturel, was born in our household. I have tried many recipes on the web to make sour dough bread and have spent a lot of time and expense, and none of them have been successful. Today, I followed your recipe to the letter, watched your excellent videos a few times and read, and re-read, your clear and concise instructions. Your website is simply brilliant. The “Stretch and Fold” video is crucial!!! It is well organized and just wonderful. Simple and effective.
In the next couple of weeks, I am going to try to bake all your sourdough bread.
PS I think your rye starter is divine. It always smells sweet, it is dry and works.
Thank you for your kindness and for sharing with us your excellent recipes.
Susan
Weekend Bakers says
Thank you Susan for such excellent feedback!
Martijn says
Hello Ed and Marieke,
Today I’ve done my absolute best to try this recipe. Everything went well till the moment i put the loafs in the oven.
The dough was dry(ish) on the outside from the baskets (not airtight?) and after 36 minutes i couldn’t keep them in the oven any longer as they we’re burning. I had the oven on 230 celcius, but was wondering if that might have been too high? The bread also didn’t burst open as I’ve seen on sourdough loafs and your own pictures. And i did make sure my fingerprint didbt bounce back when checking before baking. The crumb is perfect, taste is amazing but the crust is just a bit burnt. Any idea where I’ve went wrong? Thanks in advance!! Martijn.
Weekend Bakers says
Hi Martijn,
It is no problem when a little film forms on the outside of the loaf, it can help the bread keep its shape and also give good result (after scoring) when the bread gets its oven spring (baskets are never airtight and shouldn’t be. But it should not dry out too much, so cover the loafs in the baskets with some floured clingfilm like we do and it should be fine.
Two things that we recommend: First of all (because your heating element in the oven is probably close to the top of the bread) turn the oven down when the bread has the right color (could be after 20 minutes or so, put it on 180 to stop the browning).
Next to that the scoring and bursting, this is a tricky subject and the not bursting can have many reasons.
First look at the flour you use and for that see our posting: www.weekendbakery.com/posts…nt-part-1/
Next make sure your scoring is up to par: www.weekendbakery.com/posts…onfidence/
And lastly create lots of steam at the beginning of the baking process to help with the bursting. See tips here: www.weekendbakery.com/posts…your-oven/
Good luck with it!
Ed & Marieke
Martina says
Hello 🙂
Just came to your site, started with baguettes and now I’m looking at the bread. I have my own rye starter. Can you please let me know what is the percentage of the starter, flour, water and salt in this recipe. It can also help for other recipes, so when you have for example 250ml of your own water/flour starter, you know how much of the flour + water + salt in the next step you should add. 🙂
Thank you 🙂
Martina
Weekend Bakers says
Hello Martina,
If you click on the button ‘WKB Dough Calculator’ under the ingredients list you will see the percentages you are looking for.
This calculator is also added to many of our other bread recipes. And we also recently added a posting about baker’s percentages to our website : www.weekendbakery.com/posts…mystified/ that might be helpful for calculations when changing amounts etc.
Happy baking!
David says
I should have said 50/50 by volume in my previous post as opposed to your 50/50 by weight.
Weekend Bakers says
Hi David,
We use very small amounts of starter per loaf in the first stage of our recipe(s), so the difference in total hydration is not that big. Your culture, because you measure by volume is twice as wet as our culture measured by weight. So to compensate hold back about 10 to 20 ml water per loaf and also watch how the dough looks when adding the water. You should do this anyway because every type and brand of flour will behave differently. So a trial run should give you a good indication.
Good luck with it and happy baking!
Ed & Marieke
David Manuel says
I have recently come across your site and have made my first pain rustique which was delicious.
I now want to follow your sourdough recipes, but until I get your rye culture going, I need to use my existing starter which is 50/50 wheat flour/water. Is it possible for you to give me an idea of the equivalence ratio to your rye culture?
Argiris says
Hi guys!
Great site overal! I’ve purchased twice from you and today I’d like to ask my first question.
Right before shaping the bread, is it OK to leave the finished dough in the fridge overnight, to both let it develop better flavor, as well as accommodate my schedule?
Thanks a lot!
Argiris
Grace says
Dear weekendbakery,
Thank you so much for sharing your baking techniques and so many info about baking bread! I have learnt a lot of new things!
This recipe is great! I have been making it several times already 🙂
I don’t have neither proofing basket nor stone for baking bread at home, may be that’s the reason my bread doesn’t rise much when baking?? So I used my big heavy pot to proof the dough and bake in the oven with the lid closed.
Anyway, my bread turns out great as texture – there are small holes and it’s soft. The crust is crispy too!
Thank you again for sharing your knowledge and experience with everybody.
Jeremy Peck says
Grace
Not sure why your dough is not rising. Just make sure you have the right amount of water and that you knead the dough for between 8 to 10 minutes to ensure the gluten is fully developed.
For the first proving of dough I use an air-tight 2litre container that has been light oiled with olive oil. Then I often us a 15cm or 18cm loose bottomed high sided cake tin instead of the banneton basket for the second rise and bake the bread in the cake tin. The result is a beautifully shaped loaf with a great crust. Personally, I think baking stones are a waste of money. They never get hot enough in a domestic oven to benefit from their use.
Sophie says
Thank you for such a great recipe – I made this, my first ever sourdough, at the weekend and it was not too bad for a first attempt – there isn’t any left, let’s put it that way! BUT the dough was too wet. I could see that it was too wet right from the first stretch and fold, because it didn’t have the texture of your dough in the so-very-helpful video.
I think it might have been i) the mixing; I used a hand beater with dough hooks and timed it but I think I’ll try kneading by hand next time. ii) the humidity – a lovely English summer’s day ie it rained heavily within the last 36 hours although it was fresh and bright the day I baked. iii) the room temp. I struggle to get my kitchen up to 18C in summer; old, cold house! I managed about 23C in the airing cupboard but it will be colder there in winter.
My question is this – what can I do if I see too-wet dough at an early stage? Can I add more flour, or will the different rates of gluten development have an adverse effect? I put a few more stretch-and-folds in at the last stage but it was still too soft to turn out onto a baking sheet. ( I turned it neatly into a tatin tin which worked well to contain it so it was a good boule shape!)
Thank you so much for answering questions – that’s so helpful – and also for your frangipane recipe which is how I found your site in the first place. My ex-NZ husband has apparently been yearning for frangipane for several decades ….
Sophie
Weekend Bakers says
Hi Sophie, the problem is probably your flour. Some flours have more gluten and absorb more water than other flours. So give another brand or type a try, the best flour is milled with stones instead of in a factory. When you can not find ‘better’ flour you simply need to reduce the amount of water. Reduce it by about 2% to 5%, so normally about 10ml to 30ml less than written in the recipe. Happy baking!
Sophie says
Thank you – just about to make no. 4 so I will try reducing the water. I’ve tried to get stoneground white but it’s very difficult in Glos; even Shipton Mill have only stoneground wholemeal (which I use for the poolish now). I will know to buy sacks of stoneground when I see it! Nonetheless, not a crumb has been wasted so far …
Weekend Bakers says
Hope you bump into one soon!
Monica Hsiao says
I just started my poolish this evening and am now reviewing the instructions again and realized that even though the recipe calls for “wheat (bread) flour” the description on top says “white flour”. Am I suppose to use white bread flour or whole wheat bread flour? Please help!
Weekend Bakers says
Hello Monica,
For this recipe we do not use whole wheat flour but ‘white’ bread flour (bread flour usually consists of only wheat and not any other grain like rye or oat etc) because most of the bran / fiber has been taken out of this flour. In Holland we call it wheat flour (next to the whole wheat flour which still contains all the fibers) but in other countries it would be referred to as (high gluten) bread flour. So the most important thing to look out for with this recipe is to use strong (high gluten) bread flour made of wheat. If you do use whole wheat, it can still produce a good loaf, but it will be different of course.
Good luck with the baking!
Monica Hsiao says
Thank you! Whew.. ok I started the Poolish with whole wheat but will continue with white bread flour. Thank you for the clarification =)
Nigel Bamford says
Hi folks,
I had a go at this recipe today and it’s turned into a disaster! The poolish this morning (from a 50:50 rye/water starter which is quite mature) was nice and bubbly, the dough temperature when mixed a perfect 26.5 C and the temperature around here at the moment is 25 C so I was hoping for great things. I followed the recipe to the letter, it was a lovely dough to handle but after 2.5 hours of the final rise the dough just looked lifeless. The finger test told me it was oven ready (even though my senses told me it wasn’t because it had barely moved in the baskets and it just felt solid) so out of the banettons, couple of slashes, into the oven on a stone and wait for the oven bounce………. which just didn’t happen. I have 2 flat bricks. Any suggestions about what’s gone wrong?
Anyway, I’m going to give the brioche a go now 🙂
Nigel
Thomas says
Hello – Wonderful website! I am a total novice – just tried making my first rye starter and had good results with doubling and bubbles. However, when I started the breadmaking, noticed the nail polish odor. Seemed to be able to mix it away, and the poolish smells nice.
Your site says to feed the starter to take out the nail polish smell – tried that and it seems to be borderline.
I will report back with results on the bread made with nail polish smell starter.
Thanks for the information!
Joy Roxborough says
Hi Ed and Marieke,
Does the 15g of sourdough culture that u use in the poolish have to be fully active and bubbly when u use it, or can you use it in its dormant state straight out of the fridge? Thanks
Joy
Weekend Bakers says
Hi Joy, we use the rye starter straight out of the fridge. However we store it in the fridge when it is fully active and bubbly. When you store it longer than 2 weeks in the fridge, you need to refresh it first. Happy baking!
Joy Roxborough says
Hello Ed and Marieke,
Thanks for this wonderful site! You have helped me vastly to understanod about preferments. Can’t wait to try some of your recipes. Please tell me, can I use spelt for the starter and every instance of flour in the sourdough pain natural recipe? Thanks
Weekend Bakers says
Yes, you can use spelt, however you will not get the same result as with wheat flour, because spelt has less gluten and absorbs less water. You have to adjust the recipes a little bit for these reasons.
Joy Roxborough says
Thanks! Am doing some midnight baking at the moment but it was hot today and I got home late and I think my starter which I had fed this morning and left on the counter doubled and then receded. I still used it and am awaiting the results. Going to bed now though. Will get up in a few hours to see how preferments are getting along . . .
yusuf says
tks for the info on your site – great help – one question: in your recipes which call for ingredients for the polish can i substitute dry yeast for the sourdough culture? if yes what ratio of dry yeast to sourdough culture
Weekend Bakers says
Hi Yusuf, no problem to use a pinch of yeast instead of sourdough. However when adding yeast to the final dough you need to adjust the timing as yeast works a lot faster, so the dough is ready faster and the final proofing will take a lot less. Happy baking!
Zara says
Hi there, could you make this with rye flour in the main recipe using the rye starter from your site? Thanks
Weekend Bakers says
Hello Zara,
Do you mean you want to replace the 340 g wheat flour with rye flour? This would make a totally different loaf because of the lack of gluten in the rye.
Zara says
Yeah, would it be very dense? Just wondering as I’d like to try a wheat alternative. Thanks for replying
Weekend Bakers says
The structurea and taste of the loaf will be very different, a lot of dense, but not unpleasant. Perhaps you can have a look at our 3 stage rye loaf and skip perhaps the raisins. Happy baking!
Jeremy Peck says
Zara Using only rye will produce a dense loaf, so to add volume, try mixing the rye with strong white flour 50:50 ratio and you will get a much lighter loaf. Remember to adjust the hydration during mixing and add between 10ml to 30ml.
Mel Pryde says
Hi,
I’m completely new to sourdough; my friend gave me some starter culture and some complicated instructions and your website has really saved me. I’ve so far only made this and the San Francisco sourdough. Someone made a comment here that this bread is the holy grail, well I would say that about the San Fran sourdough which is hands down the best bread I’ve ever made, however this bread has been my staple and I’ve made it quite a few times now exactly following the recipe with strangely good results every time (I say strangely as I had so many sourdough disasters before finding this website!). It has a beautiful crust, subtle but delicious flavour and is just a really great all rounder and looks quite impressive. I would also that I make mine by hand as I don’t have a mixer.
My only query is that I want my bread to have more gluten holes in it; it has some, but they’re quite small, not quite like the picture above. Is this the flour I am using? I am currently using a good quality stoneground unbleached plain flour, but it’s not ‘bread’ flour, and I wondered if I could get the texture (crumb?) I am after if I use a higher gluten flour. I’ll keep trying different things but interested to hear your thoughts.
Thanks so much for your amazingly informative recipes/videos/tips!
Mel
Weekend Bakers says
Hello Mel, thank you for your kind words. We have experimented a lot with different flours and all flours give different results. The flour we use most is a stone ground organic medium gluten flour, so not as high as some American bread flours but not as low as some french type flours. So give another type or brand a try. Happy baking!
Bernie the banjopicker says
I’ve done enough of these now to learn (I think) that mistakes in timing are generally bad news. But I’ve got lucky…
Having mixed my poolish in the evening, with a very lively starter, I suddenly remembered an appointment the following morning, which would interfere with my stretching and folding timetable for the next day. Thinking I’d better try and slow it down, I put in in the fridge overnight. My fridge won’t go lower than about 6 degrees, which I didn’t think would be cold enough to send it into hibernation. But when I removed it the next morning – after 7 hours in the fridge, the poolish seemed like it had completely failed to start its preferment, and although I then left it out at room temperature all day, it didn’t look ready until late that evening – too late to do anything, unless I was prepared to be up all night. Trying to rescue things here, I mixed the dough, then gave it 15 minutes to rest between a couple of stretch and folds. Back in the fridge overnight. Next morning (this is day 3), I gave it a couple of hours to recover temperature, shaped, and watched it rise strongly. The result was far from the disaster I’d been expecting – a lovely reddish crust, a lighter, less dense crumb, and a noticeably more sour taste. Probably my best ever loaf ! Have I stumbled on a recipe here? Sort of a cross between this one and your San Francisco style recipe. Whatever, it’s certainly inspired me to experiment a bit… Trying to upload the pictures.
Weekend Bakers says
Hello Bernie, very nice to hear about your adventures. Sometimes this way new recipes are born. It sounds indeed like a cross-over between Pain Rustique and the San Francisco recipe. When you get a better feeling for baking you will make better decisions when something unexpected happens. We are experimenting with retarding our Pain Rustique bread in the fridge our self. The bread looks and tastes differently just by putting it in the fridge. Happy baking!
Kenneth says
Hi, i’ve started baking recently for about a month or two now, and seem to have problems achieving a good spring/ear. i’ve tried hydrations of 60-75% and it seems that lower hydration doughs achieve that easier than those with higher hydration? Also, should we bake with the convection fan or just top and bottom heating? thanks!
Weekend Bakers says
Hi Kenneth,
A good oven spring is dependent on different factors. One of the most important ones is the right level of proofing of the dough as it goes to the oven. Another very important factor is the use of enough steam so the bread / surface can expand during the first stages of baking. It could be that lower hydration dough is easier to score because it is less sticky, thus resulting in a better opening of the loaf. As for the setting of ovens, this is really hard to answer because all ovens give such different results. In general we would say start out with top and bottom heat, because (fierce) convection fans can dry out the surface of a loaf even faster and prevent good spring. You can maybe check out our oven tips for some more information: www.weekendbakery.com/posts…your-oven/
Happy baking!
Kristyn says
Firstly, I would like to commend you on an excellent website. I have found your information re the sourdough starter invaluable; this is the first time I have tried to grow my own sourdough starter and bake bread. I have made the Poolish component of this receipe. Unfortunately, my plans for today have changed and I will no longer be able to bake the Pain Naturel until tomorrow. It is possible to pop the Poolish in the fridge (as I do with the starter), feed it again tomorrow and then use it to make the Pain Naturel? Or must it be thrown out. The Poolish had risen nicely and looked ready to go, so I would feel a bit ‘guilty’ if I simply threw it in the trash!
Thank you 🙂
Kristyn says
Hi,
Further to my last email, I baked my bread and it is quite hard. I was a bit confused re your instructions to poke the bread and if it doesn’t bounce back then it is ready for baking. In contrast, the other instructions I have found state, “Poke the loaf gently with your finger, making a little indentation. If that indentation comes out completely in under one minute, it is ready for baking. If the dough is firm and the indentation stays, it is not ready.” Which way around is it suppose to be?!
Weekend Bakers says
Hello Kristyn, you can find some info on The myth on double in size;
With your finger gently poke in your dough. If you have a high hydration dough you can first dip your finger in a little bit of flour to prevent sticking.
If the hole disappears completely: under-proofed
If the hole dent pops half way back out: proofing is just right
If the hole stays entirely dented in: over-proofed
Happy baking!
Weekend Bakers says
Hello Kristyn, it is no problem to put a poolish in the fridge for a day and use it the next day. No need to refresh, you will even get an increase in taste. However there is a limit to this, you should check the poolish if it still has some structure of gluten and not turn into a soupy structure. Happy baking!
Holly says
Hi! I’m currently making your rye sourdough starter, and was wondering whether this would be an easy loaf to try out with it. Is it an issue to use a different type of flour in the starter than in the rest of the loaf? Also, is this a good beginners sourdough loaf, or would you recommend another recipe? Especially as i’ll be making by hand! Thanks very much! Holly
Stevyn McDonald says
Hello again. Hope you’re having a fun Christmas. I’ve not baked any bread for a while, but this morning I’ve decided it has to be done. So, here’s the thing: I’ve just made the poolish this morning at 8am. I’ll do the folding/resting stages from 8pm, ending in the shaping at about 11pm, then put it in the fridge overnight for the final proofing.
It’s never really worked when I’ve tried this method before (I take it out in the morning and it’s done nothing and looks like a brick), and tips/suggestions for a more agreeable outcome? how long should I wait to bake it once it comes out of the fridge?
Best wishes,
Stevyn
Weekend Bakers says
Hello Stevyn, we have almost no experience with retarding bread, however most bakers seem to do a partial proof before putting it in the fridge. This way you give the yeast a head start. Also you can adjust the amount of sourdough / yeast in the bread. Add a little bit more to compensate for the cold. You can also use slightly warmer water so the bread does not cool as much in the first hour in the fridge. This way the yeast can do its job. Yeast will stop working underneath a certain temperature so you can to help it a bit. Happy baking!
Erica says
Hi Marieke
I have made this loaf successfully several times using a cloche placed in a non-preheated oven. I was wondering if the dough can be retarded in the fridge? Many thanks for a great recipe.
Weekend Bakers says
Hello Erica, is there a special reason why you put the cloche in a non-preheated oven? The best way (and more dangerous way) is to preheat the often with the cloche (or a big cast iron pan), take it out of the often, put in the bread, close the lit and put in the oven. This way the bread gets the intense heat it needs in the first 5 to 6 minutes. To answer your question, we have no experience with retarding as we never seem to have any free space in our fridge. Give it a try and let us know! Happy baking!
Erica says
Hi Marieke
Thanks for your reply. I use a cold oven because that is what the maker (Emile Henry) advises. It seems to work ok, but I will try pre-heating next time to see what difference it makes.
I tried the retarding (for 24 hours) and it worked fine. I don’t always time my breadmaking well, so this is handy.
Cheers
Erica
Michelle says
I’d like to try this recipe but I would have to kneed by hand and don’t have a mixer. Does the recipe adapt? How long should I kneed?
Weekend Bakers says
Hello Michelle,
That is no problem. Just double the minutes from the recipe, so 1 minute becomes 2 minutes, 4 becomes 8. Because you are also going to stretch and fold the dough, it will develop more and more during the process, so in the first stages the kneading does not have to lead to a fully developed dough.
Good luck with it!
Marieke
San says
Hi, I followed all steps and everything worked out well until after the 2.5 hours rising time. My dough was super soft and now I am having a flatbread in the oven… Could it have been too cold in the kitchen?
Weekend Bakers says
Hello San,
Without seeing it we would guess you have maybe over-proofed your dough and it collapsed. Could be that the flour you used also did not have enough gluten strength to build a good dough so you also can take a look at that and maybe try another type or brand with at least 12 % protein.
Good luck with it!
Tom says
Hello from a rainy Birmingham !
Just a quick question which is open to ideas, how do people control a queue system in a domestic kitchen. I am currently baking 1 loaf at a time, I want to include more bakes so I can share my loaves and ideally bake 2 at a time in one preparation at the weekend. The problem is I have a domestic oven, it can’t house 2 breads in one bake. What would you do to keep the bread proving or would you retard the one proving loaf in the fridge whilst the other is being baked ? I have a feeling that it might just be 2 different doughs working at separate times, has anyone got any shortcuts or ideas ?
The crust of this loaf with some sauerkraut, sausage and fermented pickles is now becoming a favourite meal. Thank you so much WB, a bread changer indeed.
Tom
Mamuka says
This was my first attempt at sourdough baking after successfully developing my first sourdough culture thanks to the instructions on your website.
The bread came out quite delicious for the first attempt. I just have one annoying problem which I cannot figure out. I can never get the bottom of the bread baked properly, it is always soft whilst the top already looks puffed up and crusty.
I use baking pizza stone in the oven preheated to 230C and I bake for about 45 mins as per instructions.
I wonder if I should leave it in the oven longer at lower temperature, or maybe I should flip it over – I don’t know really. May be it is just my oven under-performing .
Any suggestions would be appreciated.
Weekend Bakers says
Hi Mamuka,
Seems you are doing everything right. The only thing we can think of is the time you heat up the oven. The stone needs more time to heat through or maybe your oven does not good enough lower heating element. So our suggestion would be to look at the workings of your oven first.
Good luck with it and happy baking!
Kashipan says
I don’t know where to begin with this message, as I’m in a bit of a panic! I’ve followed this recipe to the letter and even after waiting the 2.5 hours, I don’t get the feeling it’s risen at all! It’s just sort of sitting in the basket, looking floppy right now, as I wait for my oven to heat up. I did the poke test, and I get the indentation that partly springs back, so instead of chancing it, I’m going to just go for it.
For the record, I started your rye starter recipe from scratch last Monday (today’s Tuesday evening where I am now, a week later), and it worked perfectly! Doubling every 6 hours at least, but it was developing an acetone smell, so I started feeding it every 12 hours and it’s doing much better now.
I really hope this loaf will turn out. I feel like I’ve waited so long, and it’s my first time trying sourdough! I read your myth about rising page. Is it normal for it not to rise terribly much? Worried. I’m not sure if it helps or hurts that it’s terribly humid, in spite of the fact that I’m trying to keep the room between 25-27C as consistently as possible. There’s a typhoon coming, so I can’t really do much to stop the humidity from seeping in through the walls, unfortunately. Here’s hoping!!
Kashipan says
Mmh, quick update: My pain naturel turned out too dense. I guess it never did rise enough, and even though I scored the top, it didn’t have any sort of oven spring. My oven is a horrible electric one that loses a ton of heat the second you open the door, and I can’t accommodate it with a baking stone of any kind, so I just have to make do. I kept the temp at 250C the entire time, but I guess it still wasn’t hot enough to help the oven spring. Not sure what’s causing the problem. The crust was nice and chewy and crackly, though, and the overall flavor of the bread is fantastic, but…yeah…just too dense, especially right in the center, along the bottom. Do you think this hot, humid summer weather might have anything to do with it not rising enough?
Weekend Bakers says
Hi Kashipan,
Do not despair please and know that we always bake a lot before we get to the right result! The conditions you describe are not ideal and could impact the result. But it seems you did everything to control the process.
Your sourdough will also ripen and mature and will very probably get better with age. So just keep baking and making notes and making small variations, like oven settings, kneading and proofing times, hydration levels, trying different flour types and brands et cetera.
Along the way you will always eat nice bread (like you said, already fantastic flavor), even though it may not be perfect yet.
Good luck with it and happy baking!
Marieke & Ed
Kashipan says
Thank you so much for your reply!! 🙂
Well, after taking a few days to lick my wounds and sulk, I decided to start again with this pain naturel! I hope I didn’t mess this up – My starter was in the fridge for a few days, was nice and bubbly and fluffy, and I took it out last night, stirred it up and used my 15g from that. It’s hot out, so it warmed up pretty quickly. I fed and put the remainder of the starter back in the fridge, then made the poolish. For sourdough, does a poolish basically serve as a huge feeding? It occurred to me as I was preparing it, which is why I mixed the hungry starter into the poolish (rather than feeding it first). I hope I didn’t mess that up. By the time I woke up, 12 hours later, the poolish was mildly bubbly, and had a slightly alcoholic smell – the smell of my starter when it starts to get hungry, so not a strange smell to me. I had kept it in the bedroom with me, which was about 25C all night. I’m being VERY careful with the room temperature now. I have a feeling I destroyed my starter last time by keeping it too hot. Right now I’m on my 3rd 50min rest, and the dough is feeling really healthy. The folding is making the dough spring up into a ball nicely, it’s easy to pick up and stretch, and it almost seems to have the consistency of play-doh (if it had stretch to it). It’s not overly sticky or wet. Sort of just reminds me of a yeast bread after it’s been kneaded for 6 mins or so. So it seems good!!
My only challenge now will be what to do with it during the 2.5 hour rise. I will need to leave the house to run errands, so the air conditioning will have to go off while I’m out. I have resolved to putting the proofing basket into a cooling bag (with those foil panels), with a bunch of cold ice packs, and sticking it in the back of the darkest room in the house. It’ll still be warm because we have basically no insulation and the heat will seep right in, but I’m keeping my fingers crossed that the cooler bag will stay cool long enough for me to run my errands, come back, and heat up the oven (it’s small, so it won’t take long).
Here’s hoping it’ll work this time!! 🙂
Weekend Bakers says
Looks like you are taking all the right steps of making it your own, being inventive, adapting to your challenging circumstances and becoming an excellent baker.
Keep practicing &
Lots of loaves,
Marieke & Ed
Bernie says
My baking learning curve has concentrated on this one, since becoming addicted about six months ago. Made it 15 times or more, each time better than the last. Recently I’ve been getting bags of oven spring, decent ears, and lovely big holes with a few interesting labyrinthine tunnels in the crumb. I think the warm weather may have something to do with it. Today’s, alas, was not good. I’ve been used to giving it a really good initial knead after the autolyse, and not skimping on the stretching. I mean, giving it a damn good stretch! Withing minutes, it turns into a yard-long super-elastic bungee that I would gladly trust my life to for a leap off the Golden Gate bridge. (Slight exaggeration, but you get the general idea). And the dough comes together. This time, as an experiment, I gave it minimum and gentle kneading, and only a little gentle stretch, as I’ve been instructed to in various videos. The dough was more like wet flour than the lovely elastic stuff I’m used to – just undeveloped. Tell me, are these people on those videos just showing off about how gentle they can be with their dough ? Does anyone else “cheat” like I do and give the stuff an over-enthusiastic stretch to get the gluten to develop ? (Be truthful now! ) I’m using Allinson Very Strong bread flour, with a tiny touch of added light rye, but have had very similar results with Shipton Mill organic, both UK brands.
Weekend Bakers says
Hello Bernie, first of all different flours need different kneading. So what works on a video from the US will not necessary work for you. As you have found out, there is no substitue work experience. Baking the same recipe over and over again will teach you to deal with small changes in temperature, flour etc. We are a bit in the middle, you can watch this video how we stretch and fold. This is really my stretch and folding, not showing off etc. Hope this helps!
Bernie says
As it happens, I read your reply in the middle of yet another of these. Just done the four-minute knead and she’s settling down for her first 50 minute rest. As this is the same flour as my last unsatisfactory effort, I’ll leave everything identical except that I’ll revert to my previous stretching technique, which is a little reminiscent of medieval torture. I stretch it out till it becomes a rope. When it looks like it might snap, I fold the rope in half and do it again. Then repeat the procedure, this time pulling the dough at right angles to the first time. I’ll try and post a picture of the result. Your video was one that I saw. I just suspected there might be some competitive bakers’ “look how no-kneady I can be!” type thing going on ! 🙂 But I believe you – I guess it’s all down to our stubborn British flour which only responds to more brutal treatment.
Joost says
I followed this recipe using my (very young) all wheat flower sourdough starter. After the 2.5 hour final proofing it didn’t look like this would work out real well. But after only like 10 minutes in the oven (rather small combi by Siemens but with a good breadstone) it got an amazing oven spring. The end result is a very nice rustic sourdough bread with excellent crust and crum.
Thanks for sharing this recipe!
Weekend Bakers says
Great feedback Joost and wonderful result with such a small oven, (but the stone no doubt makes a big difference)! Chances are things will even get better as your sourdough starter matures.
Happy sourdough baking!
Petra Robinson says
I wonder if I could , instead of making the Poolish, using 145g of Sourdough starter that has been fed 12 hours before Baking?
The Bread looks great.
Weekend Bakers says
Hi Petra,
I think what you do is essentially the same. So, if you use the same amount (so 245 g) and it has equal quantities of flour and water (so 100% hydration) then the answer is yes, you can.
Stevyn McDonald says
stupid question: what size of banneton do I need for the recipe using the quantities in the main recipe above? 500g?
Weekend Bakers says
Hi Stevyn,
If you open the dough calculator beneath the ingredients list you see that the total amount of dough is 773 for this recipe. This corresponds with a proofing basket with a dough capacity of 750 g (the baskets can handle a bit of over or under capacity too, no problem).
Hope this helps. Happy Easter and happy baking,
Marieke & Ed
Mila says
Hi! It’s me, the triangle proofing basket person. I baked this bread today, and it looks amazing. I’m actually so excited it’s a bit unsettling. I took some pictures to share with you guys: imgur.com/a/d6NTP. Thanks for the inspiration!
Weekend Bakers says
WOW! That looks awesome. You are very right to be pleased. Great to see a triangle shaped loaf like this, but even more the color and crust are truly stunning!
Happy triangle bread baking!
Marieke & Ed